The WolfPack

[calleharnemark]

We all will miss you CGB, but always do what you think its the best.

[tonyy4]

I'll be honest I wasn't too keen on you, even before I talked to you and much before the rest of the pack started disliking you, but I decided to give you another chance and redeem yourself by giving you advice on how to make more sensible comments and think before posting. You just turned around and told me to stop being mad even though I was giving you advice of common knowlage, so I decided you just weren't worth the effort if you were cheeky enough to reply with a one-liner and stating it was tl;dr. You then left and then decided to make the elemental wolves clan and despite making it because of cool pics common sense would have occured to most people it would clash with Wolfpack. Your outburst shows how inconsiderate and childish you are, you won't even tell us why you are mad at us. Now I'm going to tell you exactly what I told you when you shrugged off my advice: I feel sorry for you and I hope you can learn from your mistakes in the future.

pshh i dont take advice from kids
Please you are all kids, all your hatred for me for doing nothing against you guys shows how childish all of you are after all this time so don't be callin me kid and you have nothing to do with this issue so why don't u stay out of it, is that what you do in real life too get into everyone's business?
maybe nobody likes you in real life so you come online here to act like you're cool trying to look mature but really looking dumb in the end
so what i liked those pictures i wanted to make a clan you stupid little ignorant kids just decided to take it the wrong way (another reason to show you guys are just immature kids)
i did really make a clan based on cool pictures stop assuming that i wanted to get revenge on the wolves or something you're just a stupid kid trying to sound smart on the internet
and thank you for feeling sorry for me but no thanks because your sorry ass doesnt even know what your talking about enough said i'm not replying to you anymore because it's not even worth my effort, you can talk all the shiit you want but someday karma will happen
if you wanna talk shiit you will get shit back
and you should serioulsy get a life too
stop stalking my posts
do you like me that much?
sorry but you're starting to creep me out
get the fuck away from me

nuff said

[calleharnemark]

wow Tony take it easy...
Youre not really solving this problem either...
I think you could be nicer...
We in wofpack used to be your friends.

[necrocat219]

I'm 19 you ignorant little brat. You said bye bye, now stop posting. You don't care and you have very biased oppinions so we don't care about your ignorance.

[varientsword]

You know what, everybody needs to chill. It's over and done with. Tonyy left and if he thinks that the Wolfpack hated him, he is wrong. At least one member likes him here, and that's me. This needs to stop now before this gets out of hand. I don't care if any of the Wolfpack hates me for saying Tonyy is a good friend. Let's all get off each other's cases and leave it well alone. Now, why don't we all just back off and go our separate ways. We can stop accusing Tonyy and he can stop accusing us, alright? It won't solve anything if we all out clash. With that said, I hope both the Wolfpack and Tonyy understand that this argument, and can both at least stay away. We don't have to be best friends, but at least stop the all out comment war. Ok? Is that to much to ask?

[Autumnwolf17]

Tonyy, I had no intentions of sharing everything, but you made this happen, not me.

So let's start it the beginning. I can start by honestly telling you that I was truly in the midst of composing a pm to vote on either to replace cgb with you. Keep in mind that this was because cgb was with wc and I was more concerned about the stress of being high up in two active clans. You, at the time, were quite active and quite loyal, at least I thought. I cant vouch for whether the pack would have voted yes on that, but at the time I saw you as a viable candidate. Now I regret it, but I didn't know they future then.

That was when I got the message that you had quit the WolfPack in anger. I accepted that it was because of what you said it was because of, not that you were angry at not having a good position. (And on that note, cgb and I were the only ones with the official positions because I was still planning out where I wanted to go with the pack)

Either way, you came back a while afterwords. We had all been missing you and we had worried. I was never complaining about your departure setting us back, which it did by the way, bit instead I was hoping you'd come back. I suppose you never saw the tribute I payed to you with my avatar or the signature I adopted for a few days to tell you we missed you and wanted you back. Again, it was my mistake.

When you got back, we were at first quite happy, but you more or less ignored our welcoming and greeting. Enough of us had missed you, but you didn't seem to care. And I will note that it was the first time, only then, that I actually removed you from the full member roster, figuring you needed time, for whatever reason.

Then, you started fights. First it was Highlander, and later other senior members such as Joshua. You never backed down, and in doing so became increasingly difficult and disrespectful. That was when we were forced to break ties with you, saying that you had left and didn't speak for the pack. Around that time, you began insulting your old pack mates, saying we have never really cared and we had been against us. Between that and false accusations, it really became a problem.

You left for a little while more then, and then came back one day to begin what was essentially a second WolfPack. Don't try to deny it, because if you didn't see the problems that would cause, you mist be blind.

Couldn't you see how antagonistic that was? You were practically declaring yourself an opposing force to the WolfPack, of not to yourself then to the others. Anyone who was interested in the WolfPack would see you as a second version of us, and therefore you would steal possible candidates. If someone heard that the Wolves were a great clan, they could come on and see your pack, and join that instead. In a situation in which we went to war, or another stressful situation, members might see a simpler WolfPack without the current problems, and move to it as a shelter, regardless of whether you were having problems as well.

After a long bit of difficult reasoning, I did manage to convince you to change your name and solve that problem. But, almost immediately, you began the next, both saying and implying that we had used our power or whatever to force you to change what you had rightfully created. You claimed that we had bullied you to do something that you had all rights to do, and at the same time you claimed that it had all been a random choice on your part and you had just happened to see some wolves on the internet and that made it alright to essentially make a copy.

Now comes the part that I haven't said yet, feeling it was unnecessary to tell anyone at the time. But you asked for it, so here we go.

Tonyy and Shivasisters were always the same person. Not only do they log on at similar times, at least within the time frames that the other one is known to use, but they also share the same sides to every argument. They share interests with each other, to a high extent, and they often 'know' what only the other one could have known. Not just big things that one might feel necessary to pm to the other, but little things that cause one or the other to changes their position on a discussion with more info that would never have been shared.

But most importantly, I can show evidence on speech pattern. Search and compare Shivasisters' posts to Tonyy's. They tend to not capitalize the same words, tend to have the same misspellings on not only the same words but the same group of words. The best one though is the use of the non-word 'aha' and 'ehe' as a substitute for either 'lol' or a meaningless starting word. And they are the only two to use these words consistently in pm messages and in posts.

Now, I could actually accept that Tonyy had created a second profile, especially since he wasn't doing anything with it besides keeping himself company. But then we got a new member on the WolfPack site named sadwolf. Strafe assumed that they were a member of the pack going by a different name, though was smart enough to make sadwolf a limited member and to contact me about who you were. Keep in mind we were already in the middle of spy/traitor concerns, so we were already a bit weary.

A few days later, a player named Susano came to the clan page and confessed her misunderstandings about how she was supposed to join. We decided to accept it and put Susano through the joining procedures anyway.

However, I was browsing the forums one night as a guest and saw that Shivasisters was on. When whoever the other guy was left, Shiva also left, only to be replaced by another unfamiliar name a moment later. At first, I was uninterested, but the new name left and was replaced again, and then again. In series, about twenty names or so went by, each one viewing profile, sometimes changing settings, and then leaving. None of the names after Shiva were familiar (at least the ones that weren't listed as a hidden member), up until Susano's name popped up.

The same pattern went by, 'Susano' checked profile, finished,and then was replaced with someone named poison (who also checked profile, left, and then was replaced by a hidden member).

If this is not enough proof, I also contacted Shiva (aka Tony and the rest) about it. Shiva started by denying it and in somewhat good manner. Essentially, Shiva implied that I was simply holding a grudge on Tonyy and though she said she knew nothing, she assured me that for what she knew of Tonyy, he would never do anything like that and if he had before, then he had changed.

When confronted with evidence, at least some of what I listed, along with some of the names I have (and for anyone who wants it, I remember a decent amount of them, they can also be confirmed to an extent simply by checking the dates they joined), Shiva began quite a different story. She told me that all three of them (Tonyy, Susano, and herself) were related. I believe the word used was 'cousins'.

Nevertheless, Shiva stopped posting for the most part and Tonyy came back on, claiming to be Shiva using his profile and once again going against the WolfPack by insulting us and making us look as if we had unfairly attacked Tonyy and made him angry enough to quit.

(As an extra side note, I have no proof that any of these profiles were ever used in the same game to cheat, or that they were ever meant to do so. Despite the fact that Tonyy has multiaccounted in the past, I will not attack him on that respect unless given proof.)

Anyway, on with the reasons...

As you know, Tony has just popped up once again. And now, his first action is to join our enemies in direct opposition to us. At this point, I expected nothing less from him. All it did was confirm his hostility.

And now brings us to the final problem I have with him, the load of accusations that he's been throwing at us.

He is attempting to make us look evil, as if we are taking this game too seriously and claiming that we both never liked him and went out of our way to fight him when he came back.

So here you are, anyone who wanted to know who Tonyy is and why I am so strongly against him. Tonyy is a problem and I honestly don't plan on forgiving him at any point. Say what you like Tonyy, I will continue to attack you now until I no longer deem you a problem, which at this point is likely when you finally leave for good.

Anyone who wants more information, or more proof (such as my copy of his messages to me, or the list of Tonyy's other accounts) be my guest and ask for them.

[Autumnwolf17]

Now, it seems obvious the clan doesn't like you or at least doesn't want you here, and now we have proof. And before you go for your defense on the sheer basis of age, perhaps you could look at yourself and realize maybe you could start acting mature. Seriously, I see nothing that could make me believe you are any more adult than anyone else here, and certainly not any of MY pack. I just wish I had known you didn't fit in with us before I let you in.

[necrocat219]

Read it all, and quite frankly I'm shocked but it makes sense. I think that if he really doesn't care then he wouldn't be flaming us. No matter what's the case you understand this much better than anyone else. I think you should send Lopdo a pm stating everything you have stated here but summed up and ask him to check the IP of all of tonyy's listed accounts to see if they match up and ban them. We can move on from this then.

[varientsword]

Now, it seems obvious the clan doesn't like you or at least doesn't want you here, and now we have proof. And before you go for your defense on the sheer basis of age, perhaps you could look at yourself and realize maybe you could start acting mature. Seriously, I see nothing that could make me believe you are any more adult than anyone else here, and certainly not any of MY pack. I just wish I had known you didn't fit in with us before I let you in.

Autumnwolf, I just can't believe it. After what I said a little earlier, you still choose to continue the argument. Do you not respect me? Let's just leave this alone alright. Stop fighting, and leave this well alone. We can all take a few steps back from this. So let's chill out. If the Wolfpack still wishes to carry on this argument, then I can't be one of you any more. Tonyy, you leave it well alone too. None of your arguments matter in the scheme of things. It is over and done with. I respect both of you, but now you are acting like squabbling child's, trying to get one up on each other. This will only lead to escalation, until this is out of control. So, both of you stop, right now. I'm am completely serious when I say this, you both need to back off. Both of you make all the fuss you wan, I won't stand to either of you degrading yourself, just to prove the other wrong. If you have a problem with what I've said, either the Wolfpack or Tonyy, PM me. I'm sure we can work it out, I'll even filter what you guys say to each other, so this never happens again.If I matter to any of you , you will understand, and stop this. Both of you, Wolfpack and Tonyy.

[Autumnwolf17]

Now, it seems obvious the clan doesn't like you or at least doesn't want you here, and now we have proof. And before you go for your defense on the sheer basis of age, perhaps you could look at yourself and realize maybe you could start acting mature. Seriously, I see nothing that could make me believe you are any more adult than anyone else here, and certainly not any of MY pack. I just wish I had known you didn't fit in with us before I let you in.

Autumnwolf, I just can't believe it. After what I said a little earlier, you still choose to continue the argument. Do you not respect me? Let's just leave this alone alright. Stop fighting, and leave this well alone. We can all take a few steps back from this. So let's chill out. If the Wolfpack still wishes to carry on this argument, then I can't be one of you any more. Tonyy, you leave it well alone too. None of your arguments matter in the scheme of things. It is over and done with. I respect both of you, but now you are acting like squabbling child's, trying to get one up on each other. This will only lead to escalation, until this is out of control. So, both of you stop, right now. I'm am completely serious when I say this, you both need to back off. Both of you make all the fuss you wan, I won't stand to either of you degrading yourself, just to prove the other wrong. If you have a problem with what I've said, either the Wolfpack or Tonyy, PM me. I'm sure we can work it out, I'll even filter what you guys say to each other, so this never happens again.If I matter to any of you , you will understand, and stop this. Both of you, Wolfpack and Tonyy.

I will apologize to you sword... as you may figure, it took me nearly an hour to write that with all the information together. In the time between when I began writing it, your post hadn't yet been made. If I had seen it first, I would have simply pmed this to the WolfPack.

I'm sincerely sorry to you... I will not post anymore about this to the public. The most I will do is confirm what I have said to the pack and if the problem continues, I may go to Lopdo or techgump. Till then, since you are probably the calmest about this matter in the pack, I will leave it to you to handle the situation, as long as it stays in control (and by that, I mean to stay out unless this becomes either a mod problem or a major problem with other clans, which I don't see happening)

As for the WolfPack, all non-Tonyy events and situations will continue as before.